County commission minutes, May 14 |
| June 4, 2012 |
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Sonny Munier and Connie DeCoe-Munier joined the meeting. Road and Bridge Superintendent Jeff Gutshall joined the meeting to give the departmental report. Mr. Gutshall presented a written report. Mr. Gutshall said Road and Bridge has been working on the District 5 Road and the next thing will be to cut it down with the grader to get a wider sub-base. This portion of road is between the old Hubbard and new Hubbard place. Mr. Gutshall said he contacted the Kootenai Tribe to seek assistance in dust abatement and found out they had scaled the project way back and it is under review again. Mr. Gutshall said he will just continue on with the road work. Mr. Gutshall said Road and
Bridge will finish the rock work on Mr. Gutshall said he is just about done brooming sand off the roads a far as he is aware. Chairman Smith asked when a road is seal coated is there ever a chance Road and Bridge would not broom it off. Mr. Gutshall said sometimes traffic blows it off, but it is better to broom it off. Mr. Gutshall spoke of the
culvert on Mr. Gutshall spoke of dust abatement measures for year 2012. Mr. Gutshall said County Attorney Phil Robinson said the County can extend the 2011 agreement with Oxford Inc., for dust palliative materials. Commissioner Kirby moved to sign the Independent Contractor Agreement with Oxford Inc., for the 2011 dust abatement program and the contract extending that agreement. Chairman Smith yielded the chair to second. Motion passed unanimously. Commissioner Kirby said he is seeing green house number signs in his area rather than the blue signs. Chairman Smith said he has also seen mile markers where he hadn’t before. Mr. Gutshall said if someone is putting mile markers out in the county, they should contact Road and Bridge. Connie DeCoe-Munier and Sonny Munier asked Mr. Gutshall about various Road and Bridge related issues. Commissioners tended to administrative duties. Mr. Gutshall, Mr. Munier and Ms. DeCoe-Munier left the meeting. Commissioner Kirby moved to
approve the minutes of April 30 and 9:30 a.m., Commissioners considered the 2012 Alcohol Beverage License Application filed by Super 1 Foods to sell bottled or canned beer and retail wine to be consumed off premises. Present were: Chairman Smith, Commissioner Kirby and Deputy Clerk Michelle Rohrwasser. The proceedings were recorded. The application and
applicable fees have been received.
Commissioners have yet to receive the 2012 City
of Commissioner Kirby moved to approve the 2012 County Alcoholic Beverage License for Manito Super 1 Foods, Inc., dba Bonners Ferry Super 1 Foods, to sell canned and bottled beer and retail wine to be consumed off premises after all applicable documentation has been received. Chairman Smith yielded the chair to second. Motion passed unanimously.
The proceedings ended at
Commissioners tended to administrative duties. Commissioner Kirby moved to stipulate to hold off on the appeal hearing for Indigent Application #2012-13 to allow for a formal deposition requested by the appellant. Chairman Smith yielded the chair to second. Motion passed unanimously. Commissioner Kirby moved to deny Indigent Application #2012-20. Chairman Smith yielded the chair to second. Motion passed unanimously. Deputy Clerk Nancy Ryals left the meeting. 10:00 a.m., Chief Deputy Treasurer Sue Larson, Deputy Assessor Ken Carpenter and property owner Rebecca Corey joined the meeting to discuss Ms. Corey’s request to have her taxes lowered. Ms. Corey informed Commissioners she is hoping to get the circuit breaker exemption in order to lower her tax bill. Chairman Smith said he had reviewed information on Ms. Corey’s taxes as to how much is owed for land and property. Chairman Smith said everything the County could credit has already been done so there isn’t anything the Treasurer’s Office or Assessor’s Office can do as the deadlines have passed for the circuit breaker, etc. Ms. Corey said this was not a hardship situation, but she is looking for some relief. Chairman Smith said there is nothing legally the County can do. There is nothing Commissioners can legally do to change the taxes as the other offices have done what they can do legally. Mr. Carpenter said Ms. Corey’s home is valued at 40% complete and it is basically valued as a shed. It was suggested that Ms. Corey fill out a hardship exemption application to be considered by Commissioners. The meeting with Ms. Corey,
Chief Deputy Treasurer Larson and Deputy
Assessor Carpenter ended at Commissioners tended to administrative duties. There being no further
business for the morning session, Commissioners
recessed for lunch at 1:30 p.m., Commissioners reconvened for the afternoon session with Chairman Ron Smith, Commissioner Dan Dinning, Commissioner Walt Kirby, and Deputy Clerk Michelle Rohrwasser. Commissioners reviewed claims for payment. Funds totals are as follows: Current Expense $74,960.80 Road & Bridge 50,092.83 Airport 3,472.57 District Court 8,334.22 Justice Fund 53,442.03 911 Funds 147.82 Hospital, Operation 22,194.89 Indigent & Charity 34,766.36 Parks and Recreation 6,741.72 Revaluation 407.16 Solid Waste 61,906.85 Tort 1,371.36 Veterans Memorial 210.78 Weeds 2,527.30 Restorium 18,123.29 Waterways 243.45 Hospital Supplemental Levy 2,375.35 Grant, Fire Mitigation 7,136.53
TOTAL
$348,455.31 Citizens are invited to inspect detailed records on file in the Courthouse (individual claims & Commissioners’ allowance & warrant register record 2012). Commissioner Dinning moved to amend today’s agenda for 2:30 p.m., in regards to discussing the Caribou Critical Habitat issue and signing the comment letter due to being a time sensitive matter as the comment letter is being prepared and needs to be received by May 21, 2012. Commissioner Kirby second. Motion passed unanimously. Commissioner Dinning authorized the Chairman to sign the Caribou Critical Habitat comment letter when received and as approved by legal counsel. Commissioner Kirby second. Motion passed unanimously. Commissioner Dinning said he estimates the final letter to be ready this week. Mr. Mellett said he had spoken to Clerk Glenda Poston about his request to combine morgue rent and his salary with the understanding that when he is no longer coroner, these payments will be split again. Mr. Mellett said this is a retirement matter for him and potentially, in the future when he retires, the morgue rent and his salary will be split again. Commissioner Dinning moved to sign the Accident Health Care Form as requested by a County employee with the understanding the form is just for supplemental insurance benefits. Commissioner Kirby second. Motion passed unanimously. Those present resumed
discussion of combining morgue rent and salary.
Attorney Robinson suggested reviewing this
through the Public Employees Retirement System (PERSI)
although he has not had any problems with this
and he explained Commissioner Dinning asked
if it is fair to increase Mr. Mellett said non-funeral director coroners come in and the salaries are adjusted, but he is not looking at the comparables as much as combining the least expensive. Chairman Smith and Clerk Poston mentioned worker’s compensation and affects to social security and life insurance. Mr. Mellett discussed his current budget and said if he has nothing come up he will squeak through, but he may break the budget due to having five autopsies. Mr. Mellett discussed a matter involving an unclaimed body, records of DNA samples, and the inability to file an indigent application as he does not have a name. Commissioner Dinning asked what the requirements are for preserving the body. Mr. Mellett said if the deceased is not identified he will not know if there were assets. Mr. Mellett said he doesn’t think the Coroner’s Office has authority to cremate. The costs for a gravesite and what is associated with that could cost $3,500, and as soon as that bill goes through Mr. Mellett said he will break his budget. The cemetery marker records would have to be identified as John Doe. Mr. Mellett, Clerk Poston
and Deputy Clerk Ryals left the meeting at 2:00 p.m., Boundary Volunteer Ambulance Attorney Brian Woods, Boundary Volunteer Ambulance Chief Ken Baker, Connie DeCoe-Munier, Sonny Munier, Mike Brown with Blue Sky Broadcasting, Jeff Perkins from Boundary Community Hospital, City of Bonners Ferry Assistant Administrator David Sims, City of Bonners Administrator Stephen Boorman, and Bonners Ferry City Council Member Tom Mayo joined the meeting. Clerk Glenda Poston, Treasurer Jenny Fessler and County Attorney Phil Robinson were also present. Chairman Smith said Commissioners and Boundary Volunteer Ambulance (BVA) have had a meeting in Commissioners’ Office and had a second meeting in the ambulance barn. Chairman Smith said during these meetings he made it clear the Ambulance District had been established without funding. Even if there had been funding established it would not have been available until December 2013 and this is information received from the State Tax Commission. Chairman Smith said secondly, the letter Commissioners received from BVA requested funding of $36,000 through the month of June for what BVA calls “Mary Jane runs” and then funding beyond that. Chairman Smith said at those meetings he explained that there is no pot of money the County can dip into. Chairman Smith said the County does have two expense accounts: one being in Current Expense and the other to be used for emergencies and in this case, it is not an emergency at this point. Chairman Smith said he, possibly unbeknownst to the other Commissioners, was going to recommend funding of .02% as allowed by Idaho Code for these services. Chairman Smith said he would like to see BVA put their budget for this year at $40,000, which is $32,000 more than BVA’s normal budget and then work on the following budget this time next year. This is where the discussions were left. Chairman Smith asked Mr. Baker if he had received a budget request and Mr. Baker said Deputy Clerk Rohrwasser may have sent him one. Chairman Smith mentioned this budget request would have come from Clerk Glenda Poston. Chairman Smith asked Mr. Baker if he had completed the budget request and explained that every department submits this request to the County when going out for a levy. Chairman Smith asked if BVA has made a decision or what is the purpose of this meeting. Mr. Baker said he came in
last week to schedule an executive session.
Chairman Smith said there is no need for an
executive session. The only purpose for this
meeting is for BVA to tell the County if they
are going to accept the offer he mentioned.
Chairman Smith said there is no negotiation, no
wriggle room and that is what he tried to tell
BVA. Chairman Smith said there is nothing for
the new Ambulance District. As of Chairman Smith said he was told BVA wanted to have two, two and one half hour meetings and a special session on Wednesday and he questioned why this amount of time is needed as there aren’t negotiations.
Attorney
Woods said BVA is a non-profit corporation and
has nothing to do with Attorney Woods said bottom line is BVA has a lot of contractual demands that need to be satisfied and if those demands are not satisfied, then BVA is going to stop providing the service and the County can figure out how else to get the service provided for. Chairman Smith asked if that is BVA’s response then. Attorney Woods asked why Commissioners would not want to have the discussion. Chairman Smith said because there is no money to discuss. Attorney Woods said there is absolutely money there to discuss. Attorney Woods said anytime he hears there is no money there, he can’t help but to turn around and look at the budget and really critically evaluate where and how the County is currently spending its money. Attorney Woods said he happens to know the County spends $900,000 per year on garbage service and Commissioners are telling him they can somehow make sense of providing garbage service for $900,000 per year and spending $8,000 allocated to providing statutorily mandated ambulance service to people of this County. Chairman Smith said yes as the landfill is fee based; not levy based. Attorney Woods said he really doesn’t care how the County gets the money and it is not a concern of his. Chairman Smith explained those fees cannot be used for ambulance or anything else as they are strictly for garbage. Attorney Woods said the County has a .02% levy they could possibly assess today; there are emergency levy possibilities and all kinds of funds. Chairman Smith said this is not an emergency. Attorney Woods said it is an emergency if the County doesn’t have a contract to provide this service that it’s required to provide. Chairman Smith said then it becomes an emergency. Attorney Woods informed Chairman Smith the County is about at that point. Chairman Smith said if Attorney Woods is going to that point, it doesn’t necessarily mean the County is going to hire BVA to provide that service. Attorney Woods said absolutely. Chairman Smith said Commissioners need to know if BVA is going to accept the $40,000 or are they going to close down. Attorney Woods said that is stating it is my way or the highway, which is ridiculously unproductive and very unprofessional. Attorney Woods asked why Chairman Smith thinks Chief Baker and the good group of county residents have to sit here and Chairman Smith tell them point blank it’s $40,000 or nothing; take it or leave it. Chairman Smith said he has the authority to say that. Attorney Woods asked why Chairman Smith thinks that someone else will come to this County and provide this service for $40,000 per year. Chairman Smith said BVA and Commissioners did well when they met the last time and one of the ambulance members said that he was not going to quit. Now Attorney Woods is back in here and that is when the headache starts. Chairman Smith said Commissioners are not going to discuss all of this right now because this matter will be added to the agenda during a time when the County’s attorney is present. Attorney Woods said the County’s attorney is present. Chairman Smith said the attorney is not present for this meeting. Attorney Woods said he wanted it stated on the record that County Attorney Phil Robinson is physically present in this room while this discussion is occurring. Attorney Woods said his client has the contractual right to terminate their services with 30 days notice. Attorney Woods said he wanted to point out the Commissioners are asking his client and their Board to assume a huge liability and he has been trying to make Commissioners understand what is at stake here. Attorney Woods said he understands what is at stake as he is a commercial litigator, state planning and a certified public accountant. There is a huge liability to the people of this County, according to Attorney Woods. Attorney Woods said his client and Board are chronically under funded. The people the Commissioners are relying on who stated they will not quit are the people running 10 to 15 runs per year. There are 800 calls per year and if BVA doesn’t provide an ambulance to respond to those calls, it has a huge liability. Because of the contractual obligation to provide those services, Attorney Woods said he is not very excited about this as BVA is relying on approximately four to six EMT’s to show up and reliably answer calls rain, snow, sleet and shine. There are four to five volunteers doing the lion’s share of the calls, there are units that are old, and funding is not sufficient. BVA is splitting $55 between three EMT’s who spend three to four hours on average on a call. BVA has had chronically underpaid members as there has been no choice. Attorney Woods said the first time Chief Baker wakes up early in the morning and says he can’t do it anymore, those liabilities are presented upon BVA, Chief Baker, Commissioners, and people of this County. Attorney Woods said Commissioners are asking BVA to continue to assume providing this service for $40,000 per year and he is here to say they simply cannot do this. Attorney Woods said he
knows Commissioners contacted Attorney Woods gave an example of EMT’s trying to pick up an extremely overweight person and hurting their back as potentials for injuries to EMT’s. EMT’s cannot provide this service as that is an obligation that cannot be fulfilled. Commissioners are asking BVA to provide this service for next to nothing and it is embarrassing. Attorney Woods said he is trying hard not to give a fire and brimstone speech as this discussion could get a whole lot worse. Attorney Woods said his client needs the emergency .02% funding now, which is $175,000, but since BVA is such a nice group of people; to a fault nice. That is what BVA is. Attorney Woods said Commissioners want to get mad, blame people and point a finger because of frustration and that needs to start and stop with him. Attorney Woods said he is trying to get the point across that this is serious and it needs to be taken seriously. Chairman Smith asked Attorney Woods where “angry” is coming from and if he has heard him be angry. Attorney Woods said yes. Chairman Smith said frustration is different than angry. Attorney Woods said he has tried for the last six months to get across this point that he is gently, but firming trying to make that this is a very serious problem and it needs a solution. BVA has worked thanklessly behind the scenes for the last 27 years, 24 hours per day, seven days per week to provide this service. Attorney Woods said he
wants for BVA is $175,000 per year as that is
the amount .02% would yield, but BVA would
settle for $80,000 per year starting from
January 2012. This amount doesn’t have to be
paid right now, but sometime before Chairman Smith said the County cannot raise the levy more than 3% anyhow so that answers that question. Attorney Woods said the County could reallocate funds. BVA wants $80,000 per year and to have Commissioners immediately convene a meeting of the ambulance service district to pass their levy at the .04% level now, according to Attorney Woods. Chairman Smith asked if this is what BVA wants or what Attorney Woods wants. Attorney Woods said he is an attorney and he is representing his client. Chairman Smith asked if this is what BVA wants or what Attorney Woods is telling BVA they want. Chairman Smith asked Chief Baker if this is what he is allowing Attorney Woods to come here and say to Commissioners. Mr. Baker said the six or eight people that are the core people. Attorney Woods said no, the Board of Directors is the only group that speaks on behalf of his client. The Board of Directors relies on approximately 15 to 20 people and there are six to seven of those people who go on most of those runs and take the lion’s share of the responsibility. Attorney Woods said of course he told his client that when the rubber meets the road, who are you going to be listening to? Who are you going to pay attention to in terms of BVA’s membership? Its’ the EMT’s who are actually going on the runs because the Board doesn’t go on the runs. Attorney Woods said his client relies on the members to go on the runs and most of those member runs are being done by a few people. Attorney Woods said he tells his clients to be careful about what they commit to and the level of the commitment. Attorney Woods explained where BVA is as an organization in that BVA wants .04%, $80,000 for the next two years and needs the entire .04% under a seven year contract. Attorney Woods recapped by listing a seven year contract, .04% levy and all of this comes to his client. For years 2012 and 2013, it is $80,000 for each year. Attorney Woods added that the County needs to buy some land or if the County doesn’t want to buy land, use land already owned by the County and construct a building. Attorney Woods said BVA will have to move from their volunteer membership peer model they are on now and get some paid professional staff. BVA can’t afford to hire more staff otherwise they would so they could reliably, consistently, and permanently show up for calls. Attorney Woods spoke of BVA needing separate quarters for male and female EMT’s. BVA can’t build a building because they need the entire original request of $342,000 in order to replace and maintain equipment and pay members something decent. Attorney Woods mentioned a
book for Commissioners to read as it discusses
the problem of diminishing volunteerism not just
in BVA’s Chief, members and Board of Directors are not immune to liability. BVA wants to fix this situation, but they need funds to do this. BVA can’t afford a building so they want the County to build them a building so they can house responders and the ambulance units. BVA needs a seven year contract so they can make commitments and investments in their equipment, supplies and gurneys as the current equipment is old and to have the ability to pay professional staff. Attorney Woods said people like Chief Ken Baker are simply worn out. Attorney Woods said BVA is not going to provide the County with their financial information as he doesn’t understand why the County needs it since they receive BVA’s 990 Tax Form every year. There has been bookkeeping problems because BVA cannot afford to pay good quality people to work on BVA’s books. Commissioner Kirby said for all of these 47 years why hasn’t BVA come to the County before and filled out a form for what they need like other departments. Commissioner Kirby asked why for the last 10 years that he is aware of, did BVA not bring a budget request in. Commissioner Kirby said the County has at times withheld the allotted $8,000 in order to nudge them to complete a budget request. Chairman Smith clarified those funds were withheld as the yearly audit had not been received. Had BVA asked for funding there could have possibly been some funding available. Commissioner Kirby said BVA has not done this and now Attorney Woods comes in the last 30 days and puts the screws to the County. BVA will have to play the same game as everyone else in the County plays the game. Commissioner Kirby said the County has to play the game with the State who has to play with the federal government. Commissioner Kirby said the County cannot move and BVA needs to understand that the County can only scrape from the budget for ambulance service for the rest of this year, which the County is offering to do. This is the best the County can do. The County offers $40,000 and BVA wants $80,000. If the County said it would give BVA $80,000, BVA would want more and it just goes on. Commissioner Kirby said nobody has yet offered a business plan of any sort that tells the County what BVA is going to do with all of this taxpayer money. Attorney Woods said his client does not need to submit a business plan. Commissioner Kirby said then BVA is not going to get any money. Attorney Woods said his client doesn’t need to submit anything to the County. BVA is a ditch digger and the Commissioners do not need to worry about BVA managing their “P’s and Q’s”. What the Commissioners need to worry about is whether or not BVA is providing a service, which they have been hired to do. The County is not lending BVA money, the County is not a bank and the County is not going to get the money back once it has been given to them. The County could fire BVA if they don’t do their job, but as long as BVA is doing their job all BVA is required to do is see the money from the County which they have contractually negotiated to receive and to perform the job the County has hired them to do. BVA does not need a business plan. Attorney Woods said for clarity that internally, BVA absolutely needs a business plan such as a five year and a 10 year plan for themselves, but they do not owe a business plan to the County. Commissioner Kirby said if
BVA went to get money from a bank, they would
present the bank with a business plan in order
to decide on funding and the County is asking
for no more than a business plan. Attorney Woods
said if Commissioners asked Medstar or Attorney Woods said as to Commissioner Kirby’s question as to why BVA did not come in and request additional funds, he doesn’t know as he wasn’t here yet. Attorney Woods said BVA told him they had requested funds from the County in years 2001, 2008 and in 2010. Attorney Woods said the budget request form Commissioners talk about is for department heads for an inter-County budget, not for a contractual service. It isn’t up to BVA to submit a budget to the County; it is up to the County to say for example, “we’re going to need to replace that copier”, because Chief Baker is not going to provide a budget request. Chairman Smith said BVA is a part of the County’s budget, and he doesn’t care if Attorney Woods wants to call BVA a contractor as they are a part of the County’s budget. Anytime someone is within the County’s budget they have got to submit a budget request so the County will know what to put into that budget for that following year. If ambulance service is going to be a part of the county budget, they are going to submit a budget request. Chairman Smith said if the County doesn’t get a request from BVA, how does the County know they need money, how does the County know there may be problems or if BVA has anything going on? Chairman Smith said he was not in office during year 2001 so he doesn’t know what happened then, but he doesn’t recall anyone coming in saying they need more money. Last year he asked Chief Baker to submit a budget to Commissioners so they will know what BVA needs and Commissioners could review it, but Commissioners did not receive a budget request. Chairman Smith said he doesn’t care about the term “contractually” that Attorney Woods uses. BVA and the County did not talk “contractually” until Attorney Woods got into the picture as Commissioners were dealing with BVA on what they needed for the ambulance association. Attorney Woods said that is maybe why we’re in this position. Chairman Smith asked if there would have been enough sense for someone to say “we need this?” Attorney Woods said it is not solely BVA’s responsibility to come to Commissioners to tell them what BVA needs. Commissioners can walk to BVA’s Office located behind the Courthouse to ask them how they are doing and if they need anything because this is a statutorily mandated obligation the County must fulfill. Attorney Woods said it is not a one way street and can work both ways. BVA doesn’t need to submit budget information on a form that says it’s to elected officials and department heads because BVA is not a department; they are a contractor. Commissioner Dinning said
part of the problem, which Attorney Woods is
alluding to, is the miscommunication that has
historically been there. This is a perceived
community organization, however it was done and
whatever the organization’s name is. The
community has perceived this association as a
part of its own. There have been misconceptions
over the years that the ambulance service was Commissioner Dinning said
the things that tend to happen and however we
have progressed, we’re now at a point where BVA
is stepping up from the perspective of a
community organization now to a separate
business entity in totality that will be
perceived as separate from the community and if
that is the case, that is fine. The community
understands that BVA is a separate organization
and it doesn’t have to show the County anything.
But there has been a level of community that has
been involved and that is now changing.
Commissioner Dinning said the reason the audits
were requested in the first place back before
his time as Commissioner was probably because of
financial problems. And Commissioner Dinning said
he has had one conversation with Commissioner Dinning said at this point he is sensing the BVA organization is changing and changing this relationship. Commissioner Dinning said he contacted the County’s insurance carrier, Idaho Counties Risk Management Program (ICRMP), and they quoted to him there is no mandated level of service in Idaho Code. So if BVA is saying they’re on the hook, but Commissioner Dinning said he thinks the community is the one on the hook. Chief Baker said his State
of Commissioner Dinning said one of his personal concerns is the amount BVA is asking for is more than one and one half times their annual income right now. Commissioner Dinning said the question he asks is if that is the case, why he should put his decision on the community. Commissioner Dinning said in essence his job is to represent this community, but in this case the community should have a real voice in what Commissioners do. Commissioner Dinning said he would think the BVA Board would understand the financial situation the County is in. Commissioner Dinning said you can take the County’s cash assets sheet and review it, pull out every penny of Road and Bridge funding because none of that is available to Commissioners as well as the landfill funds that aren’t available to Commissioners. Approximately one–third of the County budget is levy money. A 3% increase equates to an increase of approximately $130,000 or $140,000 in totality for this County budget. This is looking at taking two-thirds of any potential increase out of that budget, which also is looking at increased costs in health care. This is probably where Chairman Smith got his figure of $40,000 as Commissioners are not trying to be unrealistic. Commissioner Dinning asked Attorney Woods to understand the County is at a point similar to BVA’s. Commissioner Dinning said Attorney Woods is telling BVA’s Board they have to be protected and he is trying to convey that the County doesn’t have the financial ability to do everything BVA is looking at. Attorney Woods said his
response to Commissioner Dinning’s statement is
to: #1 sell something and free up some cash, #2
reallocate and reprioritize as if this is not
the County’s number one priority in its budget
every year, it sure should be right up there
along with the Hospital, and #3 is that this is
not his client’s problem and he wants everyone
to hear that. BVA is going to exit stage left
and leave the County without any ambulance
service at which time the Commissioners will
have to scramble. Whatever option the County
thinks it might be trying to get by way of a
substitute is not going to provide a third,
fourth, or tenth the level of service that BVA
is providing and it will not be dependable long
term because these are the people of this County
and they aren’t going anywhere; and finally
someone else providing this service will be way
more expensive. That expense will hit the County
this year and a new Chairman Smith said Attorney Woods is not listening to Commissioners when they say there is no money. Chairman Smith said Commissioners are being told to sell the farm. Maybe the Commissioners should sell some of the Sheriff’s vehicles, etc., just so the County can meet BVA’s budget. Chairman Smith said the last thing he said was the County would provide $40,000 for the year and then address the budget again next year to see what the County has to do and asked Chief Baker to clarify that is what he told him at the last meeting. The County would provide BVA with $40,000 and operate that year to see where BVA and the County were at and where the problems may be. The County still had the .04% levy for the district and Commissioners would take a look at that the next year to see where they want to go. Chief Baker said that is what Chairman Smith said at that meeting. Attorney Woods said what he is saying is that is not agreeable with this client. Chairman Smith asked Attorney Woods that if the County doesn’t meet the demands of funding for BVA is BVA going to give their 30 day notice. Attorney Woods said BVA hasn’t given their 30 day notice yet. Attorney Woods asked Chairman Smith if he is telling him it is Chairman Smith’s way or the highway. Chairman Smith said he didn’t say it was his way or the highway. Chairman Smith said what he said is the County only has $40,000 to put in BVA’s budget this year and Attorney Woods could interpret that anyway he wants to. Attorney Woods said his client has questions it wants answers to such as BVA wants to enter into a seven year contract. Commissioner Dinning said he didn’t think Commissioners could legally enter into a seven year contract. Attorney Phil Robinson said that is something he would not address at this time, but as a Board of County Commissioners they certainly could not. Attorney Woods said Commissioners could absolutely enter into a seven year contract. Those present briefly mentioned the terms of BVA and Attorney Woods said he would explain what the County would get for that seven year contract. BVA is asking for the .04% levy right now or as soon as can be convened; agreeing to $80,000 for year 2012 and $80,000 for year 2013, and contractually obligating the County to $342,000 to BVA starting year 2014 until the end of the contract. Attorney Woods said in addition the County will agree to provide BVA with a building in which to house people in order to provide a more dependable and reliable ambulance service that relies upon paid professionals. Commissioner Dinning said the County doesn’t even have the ability right now to provide a building for the County’s Probation Department and Sheriff’s deputies and other employees and they’re renting space right now. Attorney Woods said BVA cannot provide a service unless they have a proper home. Attorney Woods said BVA wants to move into a world in which the board members who are serving without pay, and the Chief and people in the officer positions can go home at night and sleep without worrying about whether or not they’re relaying on solely on unpaid volunteers who may or may not respond to a call. That is the concern. Attorney Woods said there people who can say they are a member of BVA and do 20 calls per year and Commissioners would expect him, as a legal counsel, and Chief Baker, and the Board of Directors, to enter into a contractual obligation with the County to provide service all over the County. Attorney Woods said two calls came from the Mud Bog at the same time. In this scenario, BVA is only able to rely on a single person. The world where this happened existed, but it doesn’t exist any more. Attorney Woods said since he’s been there and done that for some of the biggest firms and he is well aware of the fact that nobody outside of this County is going to care. When the chickens come home to roost, it won’t be in Boundary County, this will be in Coeur d’ Alene or Boise and those people will not be sympathetic to Boundary County. Chairman Smith said he takes that as a threat. Attorney Robinson said he is confused by what Attorney Woods is saying. Attorney Robinson said Attorney Woods is talking about a .04% levy paid entirely to BVA. Attorney Woods said correct. In addition is to acquire land, build quarters and construct a building for the ambulance. Attorney Woods said and to lease the building to BVA for $100 per year for the term of the contract. Attorney Woods said when the contract has reached its term the County could enter into a contract with someone else. Attorney Robinson said for clarification that this is addition to the .04% levy and Attorney Woods said that was correct. Commissioner Kirby said that is in addition to the $200,000 to $220,000 BVA already earns. Attorney Woods said that was correct as well as positive feedback from inter-facility transfers, which would yield additional monies to BVA. Chairman Smith reiterated that he had mentioned the County would provide $40,000 and then look at the budget again, but BVA is saying they want it now and they want a seven year contract. Chairman Smith said speaking for himself BVA is not going to see that from him as he is not agreeing to anything like that. Chairman Smith said if BVA wants to sue him then they can sue him. Chairman Smith said to Chief Baker that he could do anything he wanted to with the $40,000. Chairman Smith said to Chief Baker that he has tried to work with him in the past, but Chief Baker, rather than trying to work something out, would rather bring Attorney Woods in here with the threats and of being in court. Attorney Woods said nobody is talking about suing as this is talking about providing a service.
Chief Baker said he came to this discussion in order to work toward BVA’s future. Chairman Smith said that is what he just finished telling Chief Baker. Chairman Smith said he just finished talking about $40,000 and then talk about the status of things and what needs to be done, but no, Attorney Woods wants to do this now or yesterday and Chairman Smith said he is not going there. If the two other Commissioners want to talk about entering into an agreement, then go ahead, but he will not have any part of that. The only thing he will have a part of is putting $40,000 in BVA’s budget this year and work out future budget details later. Commissioner Dinning said from Commissioners’ perspective the community needs to hear what BVA has to say and to hear what Commissioners have to say as it will gain understanding for them and an understanding of this issue that may or may not have been out. Commissioner Dinning said he would like Attorney Woods and Chief Baker to take back to their Board what Commissioners have offered and said. Commissioner Dinning said Commissioners want the ambulance service to be viable, but are having a difficult time figuring out how to meet what the Board wants. Commissioner Dinning said he knows the County cannot afford to build a building. Commissioner Dinning said he just doesn’t know if those are negotiating points. Commissioner Dinning said he thinks it would be wise to have another conversation. Attorney Woods said the BVA Board has given him parameters as well as he and Chief Baker wide latitude on the remaining points in terms we haven’t even gotten into today. Commissioner Dinning said just so he understands correctly, the Board has turned all negotiating power over to Attorney Woods and Chief Baker. Attorney Woods said correct, over to himself actually. Attorney Woods said he heard Commissioners made a lot of statements about $40,000 so then he is also hearing that Commissioners want his client to send them the 30 day notice to stop providing service, which will create and emergency and then the County can attach an emergency levy to get funding. Attorney Woods said that is what he has read sort of coming out of this. Chairman Smith said if the County has to declare an emergency, it will not be working with BVA. Attorney Woods asked Chairman Smith if he is going to throw BVA under the bus after 47 years. Commissioner Kirby said Attorney Woods is the person saying BVA is going to quit. Attorney Woods said because BVA has been trying to work with the Commissioners since last October. Chairman Smith asked Attorney Woods if there was anything he wanted to present to Commissioners. Attorney Woods said no and that he and Chief Baker would go back and talk about it. Chairman Smith asked Attorney Woods if he had more to say as there is no way he is going to get more than $40,000 in that budget this year. Chairman Smith said that Attorney Woods is not going to get him to commit to anything beyond this year, but before next year, Commissioners would be glad to talk about where this matter is going. Right now $40,000 is all that would be put into BVA’s budget. Chairman Smith asked Commissioner Dinning if he saw any wriggle room. Commissioner Dinning said not wriggle room, but there are a lot of things that could be discussed. Commissioner Dinning said Commissioners and BVA could discuss options that aren’t financial and he doesn’t see any reason to cut off discussions. Chairman Smith said he is talking about offering $40,000 and he asked Commissioner Dinning if he thought there was the ability to give BVA more. Commissioner Dinning said he couldn’t see this second the ability to offer more without looking. Commissioner Dinning said he couldn’t even see where Chairman Smith could come up with $40,000. Chairman Smith said it is just like looking to come up with funds for the rest of the budget. Chairman Smith asked Commissioner Dinning if that means he would look to see if Commissioners could give BVA more. Commissioner Dinning said that is putting words in his mouth and what he said was there are discussion points and the budget is not set and to say this is “it” and there is not point in talking further. Chairman Smith said it is “it” for him as there is no more than $40,000. Chairman Smith said to Commissioner Dinning if he wants to discuss it with BVA, then he can discuss it with them, but he is not talking about any more than $40,000 for the budget. Chief Baker asked if that is $40,000 for this fiscal year and Commissioners said October 1st, which is next fiscal year. Commissioner Dinning said in no way does he want to end discussion. Mr. Perkins asked Commissioner Dinning if he wanted to do a contract negotiation in order to come up with something for this year. Commissioner Dinning said in general there is more communication. Mr. Perkins said it sounds like Commissioners are saying because BVA is a separate entity, this is figuring out the terms of the contract. Commissioner Kirby said the separate entity issue needs a lot of exploration as BVA doesn’t understand the County’s problem and the County may not understand the 501©3 issue. Commissioner Kirby said in order to clear this up it will take a lot of conversation. Commissioner Kirby said the Commissioners have made an offer to BVA and the County is working on its next budget. Chairman Smith said to clarify what he has said, he is not willing to negotiate for more than $40,000 and as far as talking, he doesn’t have a problem with that. Chairman Smith said he already mentioned that Commissioners were going to talk about planning what to do this whole next year, but as far as talking about increasing the $40,000, he doesn’t want any part of it. Commissioner Dinning said as long as people talk there is an opportunity to work something out so he doesn’t want BVA and Commissioners to leave here today thinking, that for one there has been emotions on both sides so people should take a step back and take a break then have discussions again. Chairman Smith asked Commissioners Dinning what the discussions would be about such as money. Commissioner Dinning said he thinks there is a lot bigger issue than money. Chairman Smith agreed. Commissioner Dinning said one question is how we keep moving forward for this community with the best the community can afford. Commissioner Dinning said he doesn’t know if there has been a conclusion about that. Chairman Smith said he doesn’t have a problem with that, but he doesn’t want BVA walking out thinking because the County is going to continue to work with them that they will get more than $40,000. Attorney Woods said bottom line is this is not emotional. This is business and very matter of fact. Attorney Woods said at the end of the day his client is a contactor providing a service that the County can choose to pay for or not. If the County chooses not to pay for it, BVA can choose not to provide it. Attorney Woods said if the County can find someone else to provide ambulance service for only $40,000, good luck with that one because that is the world in which the County will find itself. Chairman Smith said Commissioners know this service will cost them more than $40,000 and he mentioned an emergency situation. Commissioners will then have to go back to the taxpayers to pay for this and Chairman Smith said he then wants to see where the taxpayers come down. Are the taxpayers going to come down on the County Commissioners for trying to save them money and do this the right way, or are the taxpayers going to come down on BVA for not working with the County for the next year to see how this could work correctly and force them to go out and get a separate provider who will cost “X” number of dollars and now go back to the taxpayer to pay that cost. The County would have to borrow money for the year to fund this service and levy it against the taxpayers. Attorney Woods said absolutely and that is something the Commissioners could do now, but are choosing not to do it. Attorney Woods said the Commissioners are choosing not to do that for the long standing 47 year contractor. That is a decision the public will understand extremely well, according to Attorney Woods. Chairman Smith said the County cannot come up with that kind of money in the normal fashion. The County can come up with that kind of money in an emergency situation, but the taxpayers are going to have to pay for it. Chairman Smith said Attorney Woods wants to go straight to the .04% plus another $160,000 or so and also build a building. This all started six to eight months ago and everything was fine up to that point. Attorney Woods said he agrees with Commissioner Dinning in that the line of communications needs to stay open. This issue has been building for really long time. Attorney Woods said it is long overdue that we’re having this discussion as a County about what to do about this ambulance situation. It is only thanks to a few really dedicated, really very good people they have managed to get and struggle along and survive to get to this point. Attorney Woods said Commissioners can try and paint those people in some sort of negative light because they are making themselves heard, but they have been able to save the taxpayers huge amounts of money because of their thankless, tireless efforts for so many years and it’s ridiculous. Chairman Smith said we have heard that before, but said he doesn’t why Attorney Woods is talking about painting people in a negative light. Attorney Woods said Chairman Smith talked about whether taxpayers will blame BVA or Commissioners for the situation in which we find ourselves in. Attorney Woods said when Chairman Smith draws a line in the sand by saying no more than $40,000 ever, what do you think his client is going to do to that. Chairman Smith said $40,000 is in the upcoming budget and he had also said Commissioners would talk that year for the next budget. Chairman Smith said that Attorney Woods doesn’t like to listen and that is what the future communications are going to be. Attorney Woods thanked Commissioners for the time and asked if the meeting was done.
Connie DeCoe-Munier informed Commissioners that she is starting Volunteer Ambulance of Boundary County (VABC) and has quite a bit of interest in it. Ms. DeCoe-Munier said she would provide Commissioners with a complete budget down to the last band-aid. Ms. DeCoe-Munier said she knows there are other people out there who are willing to do this. Chairman Smith said the Commissioners aren’t there yet and Ms. DeCoe-Munier said she does realize that. Ms. DeCoe-Munier said she just wanted Commissioners to know they have other options. Chairman Smith said thank you.
Stephen Boorman said if he could help in any place, he would be glad to. The meeting to discuss
ambulance service ended at Commissioner Dinning moved to authorize the Chairman or the Acting Chairman in the absence of the Chairman, to sign the Caribou Critical Habitat comment letter when it is received later this week. Commissioner Kirby second. Motion passed unanimously. There being no further
business, the meeting adjourned at /s/ RONALD R. SMITH, Chairman ATTEST: /s/ GLENDA POSTON, Clerk By: Michelle Rohrwasser, Deputy |